tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post3444732317300606412..comments2024-01-02T23:04:02.489-08:00Comments on The Narcissist's Child: The Art of No Contact: Part 2Sweet Violethttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-2542692825870340042017-06-29T05:46:47.041-07:002017-06-29T05:46:47.041-07:00Hi. Most NM who want to control their kids make th...Hi. Most NM who want to control their kids make them unsociable adults. My husband has this problem: he cannot even smile at people. He says hi coldly to my friends or neighbours. He generally dislikes everyone, which is sad because at the root of that is the belief that no one can like or love him. I am at the other extreme: to be liked I let people use n abuse me n do more than I can for them. I suppose we balance each other out! Nikkihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15600839647160168541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-8222704348731364082014-10-24T01:40:00.273-07:002014-10-24T01:40:00.273-07:00I agree with nearly everything you've written ...I agree with nearly everything you've written here, Sweet Violet - except for *one* thing: if the N-Person is likely to retaliate in such a way that you're going to be hoping that they'll do something so bad that the courts get involved, keep the letters and emails. Don't open them - or, if you do, have someone you can trust to not be a flying monkey and pass along anything irrelevant to keeping yourself safe (specific threats are relevant; diatribes against you are not) to be the one to go through them. Put any physical documents that are sent into a shoebox or a manilla folder and label it the "Just In Case" box - just in case you ever need it in court or to show the police, to prove that there's a history of threats. Emails from the N-Person can (and should) be shunted into their own separate folder; someone *not you* and *not a flying monkey* can go through them, if necessary, to pick out specific threats.<br /><br />If it weren't for the fact that, unfortunately, the N-Person might mention something in writing that can be pointed to as evidence for the judicial system to distrust them, I would heartily recommend deleting every email they send and burning any letters from them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-24253765536906007062014-01-27T16:45:16.413-08:002014-01-27T16:45:16.413-08:00This blog has really helped keep things in perspec...This blog has really helped keep things in perspective for me. I have tried a couple of times to go NC with my ignoring NM and engulfing Nsis. However I underestimated how far they would go to recruite flying monkeys in the rest of the family. I was unprepared for such a damaged reputation and the depth of shunning from the family I thought loved me. I always went back, albeit to a lesser form of LC each time. Now that I have had time to really plan my move calmly and with my eyes open, I accept that the flying monkeys are just addicted to drama. I am ready to make the proper break. I have changed my phone number, I am in the process of changing my email address. I am even considering moving house. My partner is on board. I'll keep you posted Sweet Violet! Thanks again Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-56240930161221210872013-05-16T08:26:57.205-07:002013-05-16T08:26:57.205-07:00It's been my experience than in most cases, re...It's been my experience than in most cases, retaliation is swift. Ns don't have a lot of patience. Most likely your NM is walking around thinking to herself "Well, we showed HER!" and pretending that SHE is ignoring you, not the other way around.<br /><br />Sticking to NC is the only thing you can do if you don't want to be embroiled in their drama because any kind of contact you allow simply opens the door (in the N's eyes) to sweeping in and taking you over again. Set your boundaries, be clear on the consequences you will impose if she violates them, and then stick to your plan. And best of luck to you!<br /><br />Hugs,<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-37556246483226301282013-05-07T16:27:39.249-07:002013-05-07T16:27:39.249-07:00I love you blog and thank you for sharing your sto...I love you blog and thank you for sharing your story and great info. I went NC at age 17 Because i couldnt take any more abuse. It was rough being so young and on my own, but fortunately Most of my NMs family members had already either cut her off or had been cut out by her so slowly i reconnected with them. I fell into the same trap as ambrosia unfortunately did and after 17 years of NC i allowed some contact. I completely agree woth everything you wrote- my memories had faded and i had become a mother. I thought maybe i had been wrong about somethings and afterall being a mom is hard. My "mother" talked about her therapy and how she had changed. Well she hadnt and was only able to keep up her "act" for about a year. She began acting like her same narcisissitic self. Tryimg to control my life, acting like my husband didnt exist, telling people my last name was my maiden name when it wasnt. The list goes on and on. It culminated when i confronted her about her behavior toward my husband and i set up a boundariy. She reverted to ignoring me so i pressed the issue. She told me she wasnt going to address this with me and When asked why she said "im the mother!" which we a know meant shes the boss and im so lowly ots not worth her time. I told her she should google NPD and go talk to her therapist again but to never contact me again. The flying monkeys (my idiot enabling father and flea botten sister) launched a full on attack of my character and projected all of my moms flaws onto me. I had to ask tp be left alone several times and it finaly stopped when i told them i would file a police report. <br /><br />Its been only a few weeks and im sticking to NC. Im just scared that retaliation may still be on its way and im back to looking over my shoulder. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-62301149703356421072013-02-19T06:57:30.596-08:002013-02-19T06:57:30.596-08:00I am afraid I will have to disagree with you on th...I am afraid I will have to disagree with you on that last sentence. Very few people are aware of narcissism and many (most?) narcissists are very good at putting on a wonderful false front to those outside the immediate family, giving the impression of being wonderful, compassionate, loving human beings when, in fact, they are nothing of the kind. Most people, including very intelligent and compassionate people, are sucked in by the narcissist's superficial charm and unless they find themselves victimized by the narcissist, many NEVER see what the N is really like.<br /><br />I am further going to have to take issue with your "key," not "giving a hoot." By your own admission you have adopted that attitude with everybody who is "not quite the ticket" (which I interpret to mean people with whom you do not agree or of whom you so not approve), which tells me that you have adopted the narcissist trait of lack of empathy and compassion as a coping strategy. <br /><br />Your one paragraph sounds bitter and angry and just a wee bit superior and exasperated. I am sorry you have to deal with an NM--I wouldn't wish that on anyone--but the most effective ways to deal with it do not include adopting narcissistic behaviours and attitudes as defence mechanisms...there is no joy in that, no healing, no release. <br /><br />I am sure your technique works for you, at least for now, or you would not be using it. Eventually, however, it can become burdensome. If you ever want to find your way out of the narcissist's trap (as opposed to playing her game), please stop by again and perhaps I can offer some suggestions to help you.<br /><br />Hugs and best wishes to you<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-50074097313735082212013-02-18T12:27:57.476-08:002013-02-18T12:27:57.476-08:00I deal with NM the way I deal with everyone who is...I deal with NM the way I deal with everyone who is "not quite the ticket" these days. I can't be bothered to get revved up when people talk sh*t about others nowadays...I find it hard to see how people can get so excited and gloat about others' misfortunes, but they do...so I limit my contact with them and give a balanced opinion...they are very boring people! My mother still gets cards...she used to complain like mad about just about every one I gave her unless they had roses on the front...so now I spend 25 p on them and she gets what she gets and can moan all she likes. I couldn't give a fig whether she gossips or not and that really is the key, not giving a hoot. Most people (unless they are really THICK) can see what the N is like anyway. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-30388094618878558032012-11-29T22:57:34.442-08:002012-11-29T22:57:34.442-08:00Thank you for your recommendations - I'll defi...Thank you for your recommendations - I'll definitely check those out.MinervaBnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-17146982946282798152012-11-19T22:18:42.170-08:002012-11-19T22:18:42.170-08:00Minerva, on the right side of this blog you will f...Minerva, on the right side of this blog you will find a list of websites and another list of recommended reading. If you are unsure about your NM, you can start reading with those sites and books. The fact that you experienced a sense of panic at the idea of her moving closer to you is a good indication that your subconscious views her as toxic...it is good that you are paying attention.<br /><br />If you choose to read, the books I would recommend first are Toxic Parents by Dr. Susan Forward (an eye-opener for me!) and People of the Lie by M. Scott Peck (if you are not Christian, just ignore the religious dogma and concentrate on the psychology). Both books are seminal in recognizing narcissism and what it really is. <br /><br />Best of luck to you and you are welcome here any time!<br /><br />Hugs,<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-58948944803361666092012-11-19T18:41:50.562-08:002012-11-19T18:41:50.562-08:00Thanks for these posts. My NM just told me she'...Thanks for these posts. My NM just told me she's thinking about moving to my city when my parents retire in a few years. I went into immediate panic mode because I'd just finally managed to move hours away from her and find some mental peace. In my panicked Googling, I discovered she is probably narcissistic and, thankfully, you've made recommendations for dealing with it!MinervaBnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-86608178878783373972012-11-13T16:52:22.210-08:002012-11-13T16:52:22.210-08:00Oh man, I once broke contact with my N-sister and ...Oh man, I once broke contact with my N-sister and read an email before deleting it. I can laugh about it now, three years on, but at the time it devastated me and I experienced a renewed intensity of panic attacks and agoraphobia. It was a vicious letter in which she surmised that I was now an alcoholic, junkie, prostitute with AIDS and that ultimately I was going to commit suicide because that's how women like me end up. She left out the plague of locusts, but damn - she used every slur and accusation she could think of. Anyway, to hell with her and her N-mommy. Thank goodness I went NC and I never, ever think about breaking it anymore. What I loved about this post is that it prepares those considering NC for the possible scenarios that will ensue. Knowing what to expect can make things easier for sure. I naively thought it was over when I left. Little did I know that I was not going to be 'allowed' by them to commit such a mutiny. NC is definitely worth it ultimately, but I wasn't ready at all for the craziness that followed! It's been six years now, but I feel like my head only stopped spinning two years ago. The amount of energy they put in to shaming you, guilt-tripping you, stalking you, manipulating others to do pressure you etc etc is mind-boggling. Having said all that, the peace of mind I have now is priceless, and I am so very glad I did it.<br /><br /><br />Thanks again, Violet, and thanks to all the nice folks leaving comments about their experiences. Best wishes :)<br /><br /> Lolanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-364097740447862172012-11-13T13:49:01.111-08:002012-11-13T13:49:01.111-08:00Spot on, TW. Absolutely spot on!Spot on, TW. Absolutely spot on!Sweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-59984371020181474212012-11-13T13:44:09.660-08:002012-11-13T13:44:09.660-08:00There you go--for some people it just isn't th...There you go--for some people it just isn't the right choice, although that may change later.<br /><br />But it bears careful consideration before deciding whether to do it or NOT do it. And we much each make the choice that works for us.<br /><br />Hugs,<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-65446527455589353302012-11-13T11:13:38.084-08:002012-11-13T11:13:38.084-08:00NC is a metaphorical death; there will be grief (n...NC is a metaphorical death; there will be grief (not only from within yourself) and likely more grief work to be done post NC. One of the most important lessons I learned post NC was the use of language: Psychob, my MNM was referred to as "my biological mother" to others who were acquaintances or Professional colleagues rather than close friends. That phrase was useful in foreclosing any further discussions of the non-productive variety.<br />Much like yours, mine was both Engulfing as well as Ignoring, depending on her agenda. Their responses are predictably unpredictable: Psychob did not seem too concerned when I initiated LC/MC as she remained secure in her innate belief I would continue to play the game. LC was a function of my assertion that I was unable to afford a telephone (while securing an unlisted phone number) reducing our contact to snail mail communication only. Of course, my "unavailability" at her whim eventually led to a series of snail mail tantrums worthy of any 3 yr. old. It did however, give me time and space to reclaim my life, to reflect on the nature of our relationship as well as determine the prognosis for the relationship which was "Poor." <br />NC was the most life-affirming decision of my adult years, despite the 18 years of retribution she engaged in prior to her death. Her post NC behavior further confirmed my decision spectacularly. I would absolutely choose to deal with a terrorist periodically than on a daily basis, to have a life that is not a Life Sentence or to leave to "fate" and the Medical Community the right and responsibility to live my life free from further abuse.<br />TW Tundra Womanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12262066568878267648noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-3478792391999732042012-11-13T10:47:37.493-08:002012-11-13T10:47:37.493-08:00Thank you for so honestly analyzing every facet of...Thank you for so honestly analyzing every facet of NC. For the first time since I started reading and writing here, I've understood and owned responsibility for my decision NOT to go NC with my narcissistic father.<br /><br />It's not worth the danger and the hassle. It's as simple as that.<br /><br />My decision makes me "dirty" but it's simply realistically safer for me and my FOC right now.Pronoia Agapehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07818746040570182407noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-61005199493631187452012-11-12T13:45:01.026-08:002012-11-12T13:45:01.026-08:00That was very smart of you, Me. And it only took y...That was very smart of you, Me. And it only took you once to learn it--excellent!<br /><br />When your broke NC, was it difficult to re-establish it? Or did you have an ignoring NM who made it easy?<br /><br />The choice is highly individual, but it seems to be working for you and I am glad to hear that.<br /><br />Hugs,<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-59142582713942883992012-11-12T13:41:33.586-08:002012-11-12T13:41:33.586-08:00I absolutely agree that American culture promotes ...I absolutely agree that American culture promotes and nurtures narcissism and rewards it. And it isn't going to change until we vote the narcissists out of office in our local, state and national governments and replace them with people of compassion and empathy for their fellow man (and woman). With compassionate people running the governments, it will allow for a more compassionate populace. Today we live in a semi-anarchic "every man for himself and screw the rest of you" kind of culture where nobody gives a crap about anybody else as long as I've got mine...it wasn't always like that, but as long as our leaders model it for us, people will see it as the way to success.<br /><br />Hugs and thanks for writing<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-40443316460485200242012-11-12T02:09:59.494-08:002012-11-12T02:09:59.494-08:00My NM sent my pictures back to me at 16 years old....My NM sent my pictures back to me at 16 years old. Every picture, every card, every trophy…etc. I gave her one of the albums back about 5 years ago, so I might see it in the mail before long…LoL For people who think they are the smartest ppl on the planet, they sure are pretty predictable after a while.<br />You’re right about not reading the cards. I read one and broke the NC rule and called. I regretted it, and I’ve never called back again. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-33220345593974230272012-11-11T15:03:49.143-08:002012-11-11T15:03:49.143-08:00I think CZ has forgotten more about narcissism tha...I think CZ has forgotten more about narcissism than I'll ever learn in my lifetime! I think it's an insidious and multifaceted issue that manifests in so many ways. One thing is absolutely true: out American culture promotes and nurtures narcissism. It rewards it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-84619253617131526772012-11-11T13:10:37.164-08:002012-11-11T13:10:37.164-08:00How right you are Toto! NC is such a freeing decis...How right you are Toto! NC is such a freeing decision!<br /><br />I applaud your decision not to get back in touch with your tormenters--YOU may have grown and changed but THEY have not (unless it was to get worse). Don't put yourself through it...there is no point in it (unless you do it to amuse yourself).<br /><br />Your comment about having a sick feeling in your stomach when thinking about seeing them--SO correct. I used to feel that same queasy clenching when it was time for my MNHusband was due home from work. But as said earlier, we were trained to accept dysfunctional as normal, so we ignore those red flags, cues and clues. I was married to the SOB for 13 years, "normalizing" that sick feeling every night, thanks to my early training in abuse tolerance.<br /><br />I'm glad you got out and I am further glad you have been able to reach a point at which you can attend the same events as them and remain NC. That takes chutzpah! YAY for you!<br /><br />Hugs<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-58432141972036050322012-11-11T04:14:03.992-08:002012-11-11T04:14:03.992-08:00It is good to be out of the net - NC is a freeing...It is good to be out of the net - NC is a freeing decision, a decision for me, a decision to take time for me and those I love, to think through how I'm going to live my life from now on, to stop being met with shame, guilt and scorn at every turn, to close my ears to the constant gossip and slander, to be free to be who I am in the world. It's easier for me than for most people - I live on another continent than WWW and her Flying Monkeys - but there are family events coming up that I don't wish to miss and I won't stay away just because the 3 Weird Sisters are there. So I get to test myself - to continue NC while in their presence! Thankfully, I no longer get that sick feeling in the pit of my stomach when I think about seeing them -THAT should have been a large red flag when I was still in contact with them! Even the anger is dying down - in their own words, that's "just how they are!" No change possible from this end! Thanks for this post - I don't think I'll weaken and go back to contact with my tormenters, but it's good to hear from people with experience that NC must be a permanent position. Sometimes my head is still more in touch with narcissism than my heart...Pearlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05692900216420723573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-15379904854508349782012-11-10T12:52:24.835-08:002012-11-10T12:52:24.835-08:00Thanks Lola, for chiming in. Every DoNM I have eve...Thanks Lola, for chiming in. Every DoNM I have ever known who has gone NC has only regretted breaking her NC, never the NC itself.<br /><br />Glad to hear how well it worked for you...let's hope this encourages others who are wrestling with the NM demon to give it some serious thought.<br /><br />Hugs,<br /><br />VioletSweet Violethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08321094659806702782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4333405565931840271.post-4638125700698412142012-11-10T11:11:00.926-08:002012-11-10T11:11:00.926-08:00Great articles on 'No Contact', Violet. I...Great articles on 'No Contact', Violet. It's true - I've been NC for about six years now and don't regret it at all! What a relief to have cut out the toxic Ns and their flying monkeys, too. As hard as things can be now, at least I'm dealing with 'normal' problems (albeit on my own, but hey, it's not like I ever had any help previously). When you finally cut off that last tentacle, you realize how much simpler life is and how much more energy you have when you don't have to constantly navigate the minefield that is living with Ns or having them in your life. It took about three years for the dust to settle, and yes, my MNM stalked me, badmouthed me, trashed my reputation amongst her friends and the relatives still on her side. She did the self-pity. She wrote an overwrought letter in which SHE forgave ME. HA!!!! <br /><br />When I went NC, I had no idea what Malignant Narcissism was - still had not discovered blogs like this and didn't even know there was a name for witches like my 'mother' and that this is one of the strategies for recovering DoNMs, but I just knew I had to do it in the name of self-preservation. Wishing you all the best, Violet, for providing this detailed resource on coping and forum where we can share our experiences, learn from each other, and grow and take comfort as well, in knowing we are not alone. <br /><br />:) <br /><br />Lola<br />Lolanoreply@blogger.com